I remember around twenty years or so ago, Muslims often claimed that the Quran has been perfectly preserved from when it was first revealed until now. Back then I had no response to this.
How things have changed!
Recent work by scholars is showing that the Muslims' claim is is no longer defensible.
In the following debate Jay Smith makes very broad and damaging claims about the text of the Quran being corrupt, but Shabir Ally does not defend against them except in small ways. Shabbir Ally is certainly knowledgeable on this topic--he had defended that the Quran is unchanged in previous debates.
But meanwhile it seems that enough research is available to demonstrate that there are serious problems with the transmission of the Quran, and I expect we will see more of this in the future.
Here is the Jay Smith vs Shabir Ally 2014 debate: (must watch!)
http://youtu.be/fWHV9VnOJtc
In this debate Jay Smith establishes Manuscript changes, Shabir Ally has no response.
Ṣan‘ā’ 1 and the Origins of the Qur’ān:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sana%27a_manuscript
This is the beginning of the end for the claim that the Quran is unchanged.
Intentional Changes in The Quan (Ph. D Thesis)
http://humanities.rice.edu/events.aspx?EventRecord=22419
A rebuttal:
http://callingchristians.com/2014/11/26/release-a-critical-analysis-of-jay-smiths-mistakes-about-the-quran/
Here is an entire debate on the historical basis of the Quran. Note how the Muslim debaters are rarely on topic:
DEBATE WITH ANJEM CHOUDARY: What Does History Tell Us about How Islam Began
https://youtu.be/_8wYuiV1wPY
In this video Jay Smith shows the Muslims have severe difficulties with the transmission of the Quran and certainly do not have an original Quran, as they often claim:
Textual Integrity of Bible and Qur'an (Jay Smith):
http://youtu.be/HoX5mxBfBoM
This video is fascinating.
Here is is starting with where Jay Smith talks about manuscript changes in the Quran:
7 Areas Christianity Always Wins:
https://youtu.be/fbL5O0u_xbk?t=13m1s
The entire video (above) is absolutely fascinating.
Here it is from the start:
Jay Smith - 7 Areas Christianity Always Wins:
http://youtu.be/fbL5O0u_xbk
Textual Integrity of Bible and Qur'an (Jay Smith)
https://youtu.be/HoX5mxBfBoM
Examining the Newest Historical Research on Islam and the Earliest Quranic Manuscripts (Jay Smith)
https://youtu.be/fMJRsd8SrhU
Difficult historical questions for Islam.
Here is a series of five simple videos that Jay Smith has made that show the history of Quran manuscripts and changes:
1. Is the Qur'an Eternal, Sent down, Complete and Unchanged?
https://youtu.be/AMC-MXY3UoQ
2. Muslim scholars look at the manuscripts
https://youtu.be/D5CQ5jQvlBw
3. Muslim scholars assess the earliest manuscripts
https://youtu.be/vRlzBvCoAUM
4. Evaluating the Corrections in the manuscripts
https://youtu.be/KckGHArKC3I
5. CONCLUSION: The Qur'an is NOT eternal, NOT sent down, NOT complete NOR unchanged
https://youtu.be/iThVOVT0oJ4
This video shows Jay Smith at Speakers' corner, his favorite setting.
He raises questions like this:
What is your earliest complete manuscript?
What manuscript(s) is your current 1924 Cairo edition based on? This is the most commonly used Quran today.
Why do the Birmingham manuscripts contain material that pre-dates the Quran we have today?
Why does the Quran borrow from older sources?
The Birmingham Qur’anic folios, an Historical Response:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYBHl7QdAus
Here Jay Smith debates a Muslim at Speaker's corner, but the Muslim quickly drops out and Jay Smith continues the discussion with one of his students:
JAY SMITH VS ADNAN RASHID SPEAKER'S CORNER DEBATES:
https://youtu.be/qykliXFySWg
For now, all you have to know to show Islam is false is a six-word question:
"Where is your earliest complete manuscript?"
If Islam can't produce a response to this, then that could be the start of the end of Islam.
In contrast, in Christianity, we can easily investigate the manuscript evidence for any word in the New Testament using this software:
http://bibleworks.com/
There are probably other programs that do this also.
THE 26 DIFFERENT ARABIC VERSIONS OF THE QUR'AN
https://youtu.be/Wa3XIfEyPVg
Jay Smith shows some different Qurans at speakers corner.
26 Different Arabic Qurans: Explained and Unpacked (Hatun Tash and Jay Smith)
https://youtu.be/dcoMB8nJWmw
Jay Smith shows 26 different Qurans in detail.
Saturday, November 29, 2014
Sunday, November 23, 2014
Miracles in the Quran
In my experience, the "scientific miracles in the Quran" is not the preferred way for Muslims to justify the Quran, but some Muslims try it anyway. This approach is historically fairly new, with the 1976 publication of Maurice Bucaille's book, The Bible, The Quran and Science.
Muslim: There are many scientific miracles in the Quran. Do you want to hear about them?
You: "We have that too in the Bible".
I suggest you get the topic back to the resurrection. Not many people change their mind based on this topic. I can't answer all the possible claims that Muslims can make but here are some general answers:
1. You:
The Quran says things about Christianity and Judaism that are obviously false. This already disproves your claim.
All the scientific claims in the Quran are of no use to humanity. We have been able to discover these without help from the Quran. What would have been useful would have been a detailed explanation on how Christianity changed from the Injeel that Jesus preached to the New Testament we now have.
Are you imparting modern insights into selected parts of a naïve poetic work?
Is this something that was known at the time? How do I know what was known at the time the Quran was written?
Is this coincidence?
This approach needs more careful study:
2. You: "We have that too."
Actually Christianity has a surprising amount of material like what Muslims present, but you just don't hear about it very much. Here would be the top of my list if I had to answer this challenge from Muslims.
Scientific Facts in the Bible: 100 Reasons to Believe the Bible is Supernatural in Origin by Ray Comfort.
Science and the Bible by Henry Morris.
Number in Scripture by E. W. Bullinger
Old Testament prophesies of Christ --generally
Book of Revelation as explained by Walid Shoebat, (a former Muslim) --generally.
Big claims call for big evidence.
How often does the Quran quote the Bible? Why are you quoting the Bible to prove your point when the Quran does not even quote a single verse from the Bible?
The list above would have been far beyond the computational ability of anyone at the time the Quran was written. And yet they are easy to explain to anyone who can multiply. Numbers have no language barrier. So in less than one verse Allah could have given proof of higher intelligence for all humanity.
There is a popular claim that in the Quran, the word "day" occurs 365 times, and the word for month 12 times. Is this a miracle?
First, the calendar has been studied by since before 2600 B.C, as that is when construction of Stonehenge started. This is proof that the calendar was well understood long before the Quran.
So if Uthman's compilation of the Quran really contained this number of repetitions, it is nothing anyone would get a Nobel prize for.
Also there is the issue that the lunar calendar does not have 365 days.
Some Muslims claim that a certain verse in the Quran shows the development of embryology. Again, this is not extraordinary knowledge. Humans have been cutting open animals and observing for thousands of years.
If it had not been from Allah...
http://www.answering-islam.org/Authors/Farooq_Ibrahim/discrepancies.htm
The Classical Debates - Jay Smith vs. Dr. Shabir Ally...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWHV9VnOJtc
Muslim: There are many scientific miracles in the Quran. Do you want to hear about them?
You: "We have that too in the Bible".
I suggest you get the topic back to the resurrection. Not many people change their mind based on this topic. I can't answer all the possible claims that Muslims can make but here are some general answers:
1. You:
The Quran says things about Christianity and Judaism that are obviously false. This already disproves your claim.
All the scientific claims in the Quran are of no use to humanity. We have been able to discover these without help from the Quran. What would have been useful would have been a detailed explanation on how Christianity changed from the Injeel that Jesus preached to the New Testament we now have.
Are you imparting modern insights into selected parts of a naïve poetic work?
Is this something that was known at the time? How do I know what was known at the time the Quran was written?
Is this coincidence?
This approach needs more careful study:
2. You: "We have that too."
Actually Christianity has a surprising amount of material like what Muslims present, but you just don't hear about it very much. Here would be the top of my list if I had to answer this challenge from Muslims.
Scientific Facts in the Bible: 100 Reasons to Believe the Bible is Supernatural in Origin by Ray Comfort.
Science and the Bible by Henry Morris.
Number in Scripture by E. W. Bullinger
Old Testament prophesies of Christ --generally
Book of Revelation as explained by Walid Shoebat, (a former Muslim) --generally.
Big claims call for big evidence.
How often does the Quran quote the Bible? Why are you quoting the Bible to prove your point when the Quran does not even quote a single verse from the Bible?
The list above would have been far beyond the computational ability of anyone at the time the Quran was written. And yet they are easy to explain to anyone who can multiply. Numbers have no language barrier. So in less than one verse Allah could have given proof of higher intelligence for all humanity.
There is a popular claim that in the Quran, the word "day" occurs 365 times, and the word for month 12 times. Is this a miracle?
First, the calendar has been studied by since before 2600 B.C, as that is when construction of Stonehenge started. This is proof that the calendar was well understood long before the Quran.
So if Uthman's compilation of the Quran really contained this number of repetitions, it is nothing anyone would get a Nobel prize for.
Also there is the issue that the lunar calendar does not have 365 days.
Some Muslims claim that a certain verse in the Quran shows the development of embryology. Again, this is not extraordinary knowledge. Humans have been cutting open animals and observing for thousands of years.
If it had not been from Allah...
http://www.answering-islam.org/Authors/Farooq_Ibrahim/discrepancies.htm
The Classical Debates - Jay Smith vs. Dr. Shabir Ally...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWHV9VnOJtc
My Best Arguments Against Islam
First of all, the very best argument against Islam is the resurrection of Jesus. I dispatch Muslims so easily with the resurrection that I almost forgot to list it here.
There are a few ingredients for this argument. I will list them:
1. You need to watch this video several times:
William Lane Craig: The Evidence for Jesus's Resurrection. Southampton Guildhall, October 2011
https://youtu.be/4iyxR8uE9GQ
The Jesus of Testimony: ( this is another good video):
https://youtu.be/mpwQFYnhqEs
2. Many of the assertions in the New Testament were verifiable or disprovable at the time they were written.
There is a big difference between writing something and people accepting it.
For example, let's focus on Mark's gospel.
Now a great herd of pigs was feeding there on the hillside, and they begged him, saying, “Send us to the pigs; let us enter them.” So he gave them permission. And the unclean spirits came out and entered the pigs; and the herd, numbering about two thousand, rushed down the steep bank into the sea and drowned in the sea.
--Mark 5:11-13
Mark lists the place where this incident happened. The time when it happened can also be estimated, since his ministry was only three years long. So Mark claims that at a certain time, at a specific place, there were 2,000 dead pigs in this lake. That would either be a big smelly lake or a lot of bacon. You would think that news of this would have traveled far and have been remembered for a long time.
So Mark sits in his basement and writes out all 16 chapters of his gospel. That is easy enough, but what happens when he gives his gospel to someone else and he reads chapter 5? If he has never heard of this incident, then he will never read further in Mark's gospel. Therefore the fact that Mark's gospel has been handed down to us is evidence that what was verifiable or refutable was found to be reasonable and compelling.
When I read Mark's gospel and began to count the number verifiable incidents, I quickly realized there were just too many to count. Please try this for yourself. Two other similar incidents were the feeding of the five thousand and the feeding of the four thousand. You read of "crowds, "large crowds", "the entire city" seeing Jesus do something.
3. It is most scholars think that the gospels were written before 70 AD, because the destruction of Jerusalem is not mentioned.
4. Having explained what I just wrote, you now ask the Muslim you are talking to to help you understand how the gospels, which were written in the time when many witnesses were still alive, were able to gain acceptance, if in fact Jesus never rose from the dead or was seen by many people (1 Cor 15).
Something took Christianity from Judaism:
from a religion that avoided non-Jews to universally accepting anyone
from dietary laws to none
from circumcision to none
from Sabbath worship to Sunday (the day that Jesus rose)
forgiveness of sins by animal sacrifice to Jesus paying the price for our sin.
from unitarian monotheism to trinitarianism
Surely something very significant happened around the time of Jesus. A plain reading of the Bible says that it was the resurrection. What is the Muslim's explanation?
Very few Muslims been able to answer at this point.
If there is an answer, the next questions are:
***** the rest of this article is under construction
As we know, Muslims actually do not have a lot of justification for Islam, so much of dawah is a matter of reciting endless lists of Bible difficulties, leaving you to conclude that Christianity is not intellectually viable.
Here are two general strategies to defend against this:
1. The Atlas defense (Named after the person who holds up the earth in mythology)
Everyone understands that Muslims can't use arguments that contradict the Quran.
For example, a Muslim cannot claim that Jesus never existed.
But here is a question that has been not been explored: what does it mean when Muslims use arguments that are not motivated by the Quran?
If Mohammed wants to claim to be a prophet he needs to bear a high burden of proof.
More than that, if Mohammed wants to claim to be the prophet who replaces all the prophets that came before him, then he must bear a much higher burden of proof. He must show that he is right and everyone else is wrong.
To the extent that Muslims employ arguments that are not motivated (or outlined in some way) in the Quran, they are showing that they are the ones who are supporting the Quran, rather than the Quran supporting them.
Here is a specific example:
It is a fact that within the realm of history, there is no satisfactory explanation for how Christianity started. As Christians we say it started because many people saw the miracles of Jesus and 500 people saw him resurrected (1 Corinthians 15), but to admit that would be outside the domain of historians. So this unexplained event qualifies as a miracle, and this is the basis of Christianity.
What is the response of Islam? Ahmed Deedat and Shabir Ally both defended a form of swoon theory, but how is this supported by the Quran? It does the easy work (4:157) and leaves the hard work to Muslims.
In fact the very act of quoting the Bible to find difficulties is not found in the Quran.
How often do you see the Quran accurately citing Bible verses the way they are quoted by the New Testament writers? In contrast the New Testament quotes the Old Testament accurately many times.
2. The Peer Review defense
When Muslims question the accuracy of what is recorded in the New Testament, it must be pointed out that what was written was compelling enough to cause it to be read, believed and re-copied for others. All this was done without compulsion. For this reason the documents deserve a lot of benefit-of-the-doubt.
.3 The Paradigm defense
When Muslims recite their list of Bible difficulties, they fall short by not presenting an alternative hypothesis that explains how it came to be that the early church formed, wrote the New Testament books, and grew rapidly even in the face of persecution. The more difficulties they find, the more unlikely it is that the church would emerge and grow.
Again, if the Quran were a sensible book something like this would be found in the first or second chapter.
In contrast, the Bible has explained creation, fall of man and redemption by the third chapter of Genesis.
3. What did the prophethood of Jesus accomplish?
The net result of Christianity is that the largest religion on earth was formed through the mis-perceived crucifixion of Jesus.
4.What reason does the Quran give for why we should believe in its revelation?
The New Testament reads like a historical narrative by people who were drawn into Christianity by what they had seen. There is nothing else like the Bible.
The person who writes the rebuttal to a certain work always has the advantage. This is why, in the legal system, the defendant is always granted the opportunity to have the last word to the jury. The Quran came after the Bible, and also has the advantage that it was written by Allah. And yet we see Muslim scholars quote every sort of liberal Christian scholars in defense of Islam, but not the Quran. This proves the Quran does not provide a good roadmap for Muslims trying to disprove Christianity.
The Quran says "Truth stands out clear from Error"
--Quran 2:256
And yet Muslims cannot present a clearly superior case for Islam than Christians can for Christianity.
It is would be perhaps defensible for Allah to cast people into hellfire if he had revealed himself to them and they willingly and openly rebelled against him. But Allah has not.
And not only has he not revealed himself but he has actually mislead people by making it appear that Jesus was crucified.
There are a few ingredients for this argument. I will list them:
1. You need to watch this video several times:
William Lane Craig: The Evidence for Jesus's Resurrection. Southampton Guildhall, October 2011
https://youtu.be/4iyxR8uE9GQ
The Jesus of Testimony: ( this is another good video):
https://youtu.be/mpwQFYnhqEs
2. Many of the assertions in the New Testament were verifiable or disprovable at the time they were written.
There is a big difference between writing something and people accepting it.
For example, let's focus on Mark's gospel.
Now a great herd of pigs was feeding there on the hillside, and they begged him, saying, “Send us to the pigs; let us enter them.” So he gave them permission. And the unclean spirits came out and entered the pigs; and the herd, numbering about two thousand, rushed down the steep bank into the sea and drowned in the sea.
--Mark 5:11-13
Mark lists the place where this incident happened. The time when it happened can also be estimated, since his ministry was only three years long. So Mark claims that at a certain time, at a specific place, there were 2,000 dead pigs in this lake. That would either be a big smelly lake or a lot of bacon. You would think that news of this would have traveled far and have been remembered for a long time.
So Mark sits in his basement and writes out all 16 chapters of his gospel. That is easy enough, but what happens when he gives his gospel to someone else and he reads chapter 5? If he has never heard of this incident, then he will never read further in Mark's gospel. Therefore the fact that Mark's gospel has been handed down to us is evidence that what was verifiable or refutable was found to be reasonable and compelling.
When I read Mark's gospel and began to count the number verifiable incidents, I quickly realized there were just too many to count. Please try this for yourself. Two other similar incidents were the feeding of the five thousand and the feeding of the four thousand. You read of "crowds, "large crowds", "the entire city" seeing Jesus do something.
3. It is most scholars think that the gospels were written before 70 AD, because the destruction of Jerusalem is not mentioned.
4. Having explained what I just wrote, you now ask the Muslim you are talking to to help you understand how the gospels, which were written in the time when many witnesses were still alive, were able to gain acceptance, if in fact Jesus never rose from the dead or was seen by many people (1 Cor 15).
Something took Christianity from Judaism:
from a religion that avoided non-Jews to universally accepting anyone
from dietary laws to none
from circumcision to none
from Sabbath worship to Sunday (the day that Jesus rose)
forgiveness of sins by animal sacrifice to Jesus paying the price for our sin.
from unitarian monotheism to trinitarianism
Surely something very significant happened around the time of Jesus. A plain reading of the Bible says that it was the resurrection. What is the Muslim's explanation?
Very few Muslims been able to answer at this point.
If there is an answer, the next questions are:
- What in the Quran motivates your answer?
- Are you helping the Quran or is it helping you?
***** the rest of this article is under construction
As we know, Muslims actually do not have a lot of justification for Islam, so much of dawah is a matter of reciting endless lists of Bible difficulties, leaving you to conclude that Christianity is not intellectually viable.
Here are two general strategies to defend against this:
1. The Atlas defense (Named after the person who holds up the earth in mythology)
Everyone understands that Muslims can't use arguments that contradict the Quran.
For example, a Muslim cannot claim that Jesus never existed.
But here is a question that has been not been explored: what does it mean when Muslims use arguments that are not motivated by the Quran?
If Mohammed wants to claim to be a prophet he needs to bear a high burden of proof.
More than that, if Mohammed wants to claim to be the prophet who replaces all the prophets that came before him, then he must bear a much higher burden of proof. He must show that he is right and everyone else is wrong.
To the extent that Muslims employ arguments that are not motivated (or outlined in some way) in the Quran, they are showing that they are the ones who are supporting the Quran, rather than the Quran supporting them.
Here is a specific example:
It is a fact that within the realm of history, there is no satisfactory explanation for how Christianity started. As Christians we say it started because many people saw the miracles of Jesus and 500 people saw him resurrected (1 Corinthians 15), but to admit that would be outside the domain of historians. So this unexplained event qualifies as a miracle, and this is the basis of Christianity.
What is the response of Islam? Ahmed Deedat and Shabir Ally both defended a form of swoon theory, but how is this supported by the Quran? It does the easy work (4:157) and leaves the hard work to Muslims.
In fact the very act of quoting the Bible to find difficulties is not found in the Quran.
How often do you see the Quran accurately citing Bible verses the way they are quoted by the New Testament writers? In contrast the New Testament quotes the Old Testament accurately many times.
2. The Peer Review defense
When Muslims question the accuracy of what is recorded in the New Testament, it must be pointed out that what was written was compelling enough to cause it to be read, believed and re-copied for others. All this was done without compulsion. For this reason the documents deserve a lot of benefit-of-the-doubt.
.3 The Paradigm defense
When Muslims recite their list of Bible difficulties, they fall short by not presenting an alternative hypothesis that explains how it came to be that the early church formed, wrote the New Testament books, and grew rapidly even in the face of persecution. The more difficulties they find, the more unlikely it is that the church would emerge and grow.
Again, if the Quran were a sensible book something like this would be found in the first or second chapter.
In contrast, the Bible has explained creation, fall of man and redemption by the third chapter of Genesis.
3. What did the prophethood of Jesus accomplish?
The net result of Christianity is that the largest religion on earth was formed through the mis-perceived crucifixion of Jesus.
4.What reason does the Quran give for why we should believe in its revelation?
The New Testament reads like a historical narrative by people who were drawn into Christianity by what they had seen. There is nothing else like the Bible.
The person who writes the rebuttal to a certain work always has the advantage. This is why, in the legal system, the defendant is always granted the opportunity to have the last word to the jury. The Quran came after the Bible, and also has the advantage that it was written by Allah. And yet we see Muslim scholars quote every sort of liberal Christian scholars in defense of Islam, but not the Quran. This proves the Quran does not provide a good roadmap for Muslims trying to disprove Christianity.
The Quran says "Truth stands out clear from Error"
--Quran 2:256
And yet Muslims cannot present a clearly superior case for Islam than Christians can for Christianity.
It is would be perhaps defensible for Allah to cast people into hellfire if he had revealed himself to them and they willingly and openly rebelled against him. But Allah has not.
And not only has he not revealed himself but he has actually mislead people by making it appear that Jesus was crucified.
Tuesday, November 18, 2014
If there is a God why is there so much EVIL in the World?
,,,Or maybe, if there is NO god, why is there so much GOOD in the world?
Intro: Isn't it Narrow-minded to say that "Jesus is the Only Way" *
No, rather it shows how lost humanity is.
We should appreciate the one way that we have, and what a price was paid for our salvation!
And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?
--1 Peter 4:18
I believe that Islam needs to be confronted rather than embraced. If you believe that it was right for the Pope to kiss the Quran, then this is the wrong blog for you.
We should appreciate the one way that we have, and what a price was paid for our salvation!
And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?
--1 Peter 4:18
I believe that Islam needs to be confronted rather than embraced. If you believe that it was right for the Pope to kiss the Quran, then this is the wrong blog for you.
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